Patshala se School

[Dedh Quintal]

Now if the thread would have read madrassa it would have been termed the terror thread and what not.



Any way starting this thread not to discuss this but to discuss, education and its development.



Present has passed through dark ages to middle to now and is supposedly the best era.



Is it true ?



Maybe.



Whats this got to do with education.?



Hmm , yes what and where is the global education system heading to and what is it acheiving ?



What the education system was, there would be scholars and teachers who would teach, and the interested would float and learn from these scholars.

This gave an oppurtunity for everybody to learn everything according to interest. The scholars charged no fees, it was guru dakshina or hadiya.



What has it now come to, the education system has become an industry like any other industry. The film industry, the sex industry, the education industry.



It all boils down to $, Rs, Yen. The Imparting of knowledge is disappearing, its all now preparing the next gen competitve individuals!!!

[mark]

agreed. modern life is a factory process, designed to churn out "normal" people, who think, dress and act the same, and are easy to control with sex, religion and TV. This process starts from birth, with the indoctrination rites into whatever religion, and continues in school where we are force-fed standardised bullsh1t, forced to learn poems and equations off by heart, forced to conform. working life is the final shovel of clay onto our grave, we have an endless number of artificial goals and carrots to inject false, transparent meaning to our (by now) worthless lives.

we get married, we create more raw material for the machine, then we die.

we squeeze ourselves into cities when there is a vast, empty countryside all around, and then we give out about the infrastructure and the pollution and the corrupt politicians. we cram our bodies into packed busses every day, we sit in little cubicles in overcrowded offices, when we die our bodies will be buried next to thousands of other buried bodies.

we are voluntary chickens in the largest battery farm ever created.

[Mayavi Morpheus]

Now if the thread would have read madrassa it would have been termed the terror thread and what not.

Yep, cos they only teach religion in madarassas (most of them anyway) and we all know what the results are (look outside India)

Any way starting this thread not to discuss this but to discuss, education and its development.

Good topic

Present has passed through dark ages to middle to now and is supposedly the best era.

Is it true ?

Nope, atleast not for India.

Hmm , yes what and where is the global education system heading to and what is it acheiving ?

What the education system was, there would be scholars and teachers who would teach, and the interested would float and learn from these scholars.
This gave an oppurtunity for everybody to learn everything according to interest. The scholars charged no fees, it was guru dakshina or hadiya.

What has it now come to, the education system has become an industry like any other industry. The film industry, the sex industry, the education industry.

It all boils down to $, Rs, Yen. The Imparting of knowledge is disappearing, its all now preparing the next gen competitve individuals!!!

What is wrong with that? If you want high quality education, you gotta part with the money atleast until the state as a whole is rich enough to subsidize education.

In the good 'ol times you are referring to, this is what used to happen. The state used to pay for the gurukuls/madarassas etc. and whatever the student pay the teacher, guru dakshini, is just an additional income. So the present model is not much different.

Now you may ask why do the schools have to charge money to teach. The answer is simple - everyone needs money. To pay for the teachers, fund the infrastrucutre, provide good enironment, mid day meals etc. All these need money which is collected from the parents and in the process some individuals also get richer. But knowledge is being imparted nevertheless.

Take a look at US school system. US has the system of mandatory high school education for all children. The state funds the schools from the tax money and every kid in the neighborhood goes to the government school in his area. Not doing so is a crime and parents will face charges.

[lol]

agreed. modern life is a factory process, designed to churn out "normal" people, who think, dress and act the same, and are easy to control with sex, religion and TV. This process starts from birth, with the indoctrination rites into whatever religion, and continues in school where we are force-fed standardised bullsh1t, forced to learn poems and equations off by heart, forced to conform. working life is the final shovel of clay onto our grave, we have an endless number of artificial goals and carrots to inject false, transparent meaning to our (by now) worthless lives.
we get married, we create more raw material for the machine, then we die.
we squeeze ourselves into cities when there is a vast, empty countryside all around, and then we give out about the infrastructure and the pollution and the corrupt politicians. we cram our bodies into packed busses every day, we sit in little cubicles in overcrowded offices, when we die our bodies will be buried next to thousands of other buried bodies.
we are voluntary chickens in the largest battery farm ever created.

LOL. I Know you have driven this thread towards the dearth of spam.



Don't ever let yourself when depressed people are around, youll drive them to suicide. He he he.



The funniest description of life I have ever read.

[mark]

agreed. modern life is a factory process, designed to churn out "normal" people, who think, dress and act the same, and are easy to control with sex, religion and TV. This process starts from birth, with the indoctrination rites into whatever religion, and continues in school where we are force-fed standardised bullsh1t, forced to learn poems and equations off by heart, forced to conform. working life is the final shovel of clay onto our grave, we have an endless number of artificial goals and carrots to inject false, transparent meaning to our (by now) worthless lives.
we get married, we create more raw material for the machine, then we die.
we squeeze ourselves into cities when there is a vast, empty countryside all around, and then we give out about the infrastructure and the pollution and the corrupt politicians. we cram our bodies into packed busses every day, we sit in little cubicles in overcrowded offices, when we die our bodies will be buried next to thousands of other buried bodies.
we are voluntary chickens in the largest battery farm ever created.

LOL. I Know you have driven this thread towards the dearth of spam.

Don't ever let yourself when depressed people are around, youll drive them to suicide. He he he.

The funniest description of life I have ever read.

i'm a little ray of sunshine

[CtrlAltDel]

free compelsory education atleast till the High School level, if not university, is ideal to ensure a good literacy level in the population.



education has become a business in India and i really do not see how to rectify this. free or subsidised education is synonymous with government schools and i do not think citizens in middle class or above would consider educating their kids in a govt. school (excl. Kendriya Vidhyalayas).



i have no complaint against paying fees, provided the school offers various facilities to the students, like sports, extra-curricular activites, personality building etc. these extra facilities are difficult to have without funds.



for good free/subsidised education to be possible, the govt needs to pump in more and more money into education (atleast abt 10-20% of GDP)which is not being done. if expenses on arms and weapons is halved, this would be possible but in the current scenario its wishful thinking.



many European countries have free education upto university level, but thsi is coz they live in peaceful conditions and can afford to spend high on education.



IMO, free/subsidised education is not possible in india as long as there is no peace in the neighborhood or within the country itself.

[vakibs]

hey dedh

Dont panic. Agreed the education system sucks now and like mark said, it is all like a big factory engine. But wiith the technological advancement, it is inevitable that this education system will collapse (quoting from Karl Marx, society will work out a way to remove impediments of technological progress.. this current education system is an impediment)



In brief, what shall defeat the current system is "virtual reality in an internetworked world" Schools and universities will cesae to exist. Give or take 50 years. First quality education will become available at almost-for-free to everyone in the world. This automatically removes economical inequalities like we know them now.



- vakibs

[akhilis2cool]

School Education is now a fundamental right in india. this means the govt. is spending huge sums of money to provide education thru the govt. schools. But this itself is not good enuf as the infrastructure in these schools is very poor.



If this system has to b revived, that is getting the schools back on track, then there has to b lesser govt. control over the process of education. The pvt. sector has to b roped into it. the Govt.-Pvt. Sector combo. has worked well in many areas, I am sure it'll succeed here also.

[vakibs]

What is wrong with that? If you want high quality education, you gotta part with the money atleast until the state as a whole is rich enough to subsidize education.
... Now you may ask why do the schools have to charge money to teach. The answer is simple - everyone needs money. To pay for the teachers, fund the infrastrucutre, provide good enironment, mid day meals etc.

It is all about purchasing-power Morpheus. Education is a product which should not be allowed to dance to the tune of market forces. I have an answer for why the cost of imparting education will come down. This is because soon they dont have to pay for the teachers, they dont have to construct huge buildings for schools (or rather factories). Basic education shall be delivered on demand through virtual reality via the internet.

[Sharjel]

Are we any less responsible for all the things that we crib about?



We are allowing ourselves to be brainwashed by religious freaks, or full bodied women in skimpy swimwear, or scientists who want us to believe that the world just exists on its own, or whoever. They all exeist just because we want them to. It is human tendency to cling onto things, be it our mother's skirt, or God, or the TV remote.



As far as education is concerned, it has been the same since the beginning of time. Good teachers and knowledge have always been elusive. The people who have succeede in attaining knowledge are called experts, legends, or Gods. In the old times, people would walk/ride hundreds of miles to learn. As an example, consider this:



In old times, when someone was serious about MA and had the talent, he would select a good teacher and live with him, becoming his Uchi Deshi (private disciple), thus gaining the most from the Master's teachings.



It is the same today, we just have to look harder to get the better teacher.

[CtrlAltDel]

This is because soon they dont have to pay for the teachers, they dont have to construct huge buildings for schools (or rather factories). Basic education shall be delivered on demand through virtual reality via the internet.

that wud be sad scenario IMO....there wud be no fun, no pleasant memories of the school or college days...no tales of 'Hitler' teachers, teachers-whose-pallus-slip-in-classroom tales , no teasing abt "girlfriends", no sports days, no annual days...



...man...i miss my school

[vakibs]

free compelsory education atleast till the High School level, if not university, is ideal to ensure a good literacy level in the population... IMO, free/subsidised education is not possible in india as long as there is no peace in the neighborhood or within the country itself.

This is true CAD. If education has to be given money, expenditure on arms should go down. But I think the root problem is not about putting money, but refusing to look at this as an organic growth. My parents are teachers in government-run schools, and I know what happens to the expensive laboratory equipment that is donated by the govt. Nobody uses them !! It is insane.... Unless the people have a genuine desire to get high-quality education, the situation doesnt get better. The goal of the govt. is to cultivate this desire.

[CtrlAltDel]

Unless the people have a genuine desire to get high-quality education, the situation doesnt get better. The goal of the govt. is to cultivate this desire.

fat chance, as long as the only goal of all students and parents is that curse called EAMCET (or other equivalent exams)



ever notice something guys? these days ppl opting for science as a career has come down. the BSc->MSc->PhD route that produced the great scientists in the old decades has less takers now. this is a sad scenario. we are busy producing software coolies and less scientists. only ppl who do not get into engineering or medicine reluctantly opt for BSc, and i dont see them becoming scientists.



our self-sufficiency in nuke and other cutting-edge technologies wud become a joke in the coming decades

[vakibs]

This is because soon they dont have to pay for the teachers, they dont have to construct huge buildings for schools (or rather factories). Basic education shall be delivered on demand through virtual reality via the internet.

that wud be sad scenario IMO....there wud be no fun, no pleasant memories of the school or college days...no tales of 'Hitler' teachers, teachers-whose-pallus-slip-in-classroom tales , no teasing abt "girlfriends", no sports days, no annual days...

...man...i miss my school

arre the GOD !! the Supreme One is saying this Aint we having fun on these forums here.. ? Wouldnt it be nicer if we had this in our school days. Ofcourse the annual days and sports days should be there.. They are the only fun element in school !!

[mark]

Are we any less responsible for all the things that we crib about?

i agree, we're all cogs that keep the whole thing working.



On education, i come from a country where education is "free", up to when you get your first degree. (taught) postgrads have to be paid for.

the problem with this is that the fees only represent a portion of the cost of education, especially at university where the student will most likely be living away from home.

Because the government is heavily subsidising education for all, it can't afford to give decent grants to people from poor backgrounds (example: grant for student living in Dublin in 2001: 70 punts per week. cost of student accomodation per week: 100 punts) then there's the large quantity of booze necessary for proper reflection on life's problems, and after that you still have to pay for your food.

Most would prefer (and i think that's the way Ireland has gone since i left) a proper system of grants in place for students from poor backgrounds, and for students with a more affluent background to pay their way. It's a difficult call though.

[Sharjeel]

Unless the people have a genuine desire to get high-quality education, the situation doesnt get better. The goal of the govt. is to cultivate this desire.

fat chance, as long as the only goal of all students and parents is that curse called EAMCET (or other equivalent exams)

ever notice something guys? these days ppl opting for science as a career has come down. the BSc->MSc->PhD route that produced the great scientists in the old decades has less takers now. this is a sad scenario. we are busy producing software coolies and less scientists. only ppl who do not get into engineering or medicine reluctantly opt for BSc, and i dont see them becoming scientists.

our self-sufficiency in nuke and other cutting-edge technologies wud become a joke in the coming decades

But it never took schools to make a scientist.



The point is that we ourselves decide if we want to get an education. If we want, we can become Engineers without gaining an iota of knwoledge, or skip chool/college and still become a scientist.

[DQ]

This is because soon they dont have to pay for the teachers, they dont have to construct huge buildings for schools (or rather factories). Basic education shall be delivered on demand through virtual reality via the internet.

that wud be sad scenario IMO....there wud be no fun, no pleasant memories of the school or college days...no tales of 'Hitler' teachers, teachers-whose-pallus-slip-in-classroom tales , no teasing abt "girlfriends", no sports days, no annual days...

...man...i miss my school

I was gonna jot this in the first post but yea as CAD points here, I have also heard that Schools and Colleges are these days employing, Spik and Spank teachers too just to attract that crowd, be it the Pupil or that moter and father who would come for the Teacher !!!



Vakibs and Mayavi, will get back on each of your posts. Dont have enough time on hand today, will do so anytime this week.

[akhilis2cool]

free compelsory education atleast till the High School level, if not university, is ideal to ensure a good literacy level in the population... IMO, free/subsidised education is not possible in india as long as there is no peace in the neighborhood or within the country itself.

This is true CAD. If education has to be given money, expenditure on arms should go down. But I think the root problem is not about putting money, but refusing to look at this as an organic growth. My parents are teachers in government-run schools, and I know what happens to the expensive laboratory equipment that is donated by the govt. Nobody uses them !! It is insane.... Unless the people have a genuine desire to get high-quality education, the situation doesnt get better. The goal of the govt. is to cultivate this desire.

All goes down to the vicious cycle...

people in rural areas make there kids work rather than learn...thats coz there isnt enuf money...theres isnt enuf money coz the govt. doesnt provide jobs...or they are indebted to a money lender. Though the govt. announces a whole lot of plans each year for providing education (and they have had some good results) they are mostly ill planned...or poorly excuted (and hence the money ends up in a few bottomless pockets ).

Though theres enuf Macro level planning going the ground level realities have been ignored. thats where the pvt. sector or NGOs and come in and do the job.

The Govt. Plans.

the Pvt. Sector and NGOs execute.

[vakibs]

]fat chance, as long as the only goal of all students and parents is that curse called EAMCET (or other equivalent exams)

Those 2 _ years in my life !! It seems so distant now that I could hardly tell whether they happened at all. Walking to study-hours in long queues with studying-chairs in our hands. Getting paraded around the college building for getting low marks. Eating shit food everyday before burning midnight oil on studying shit. Mark, do you know about all this ?

[mark]

]fat chance, as long as the only goal of all students and parents is that curse called EAMCET (or other equivalent exams)

Those 2 _ years in my life !! It seems so distant now that I could hardly tell whether they happened at all. Walking to study-hours in long queues with studying-chairs in our hands. Getting paraded around the college building for getting low marks. Eating shit food everyday before burning midnight oil on studying shit. Mark, do you know about all this ?

nope. sounds similar to our leaving certificate though, 2 years, 1 marathon round of exams, and a score from 0 - 600 which determines what university course you'll be able to do. 2 years of hell, made up for only by the drunken insanity that is 1st year in uni.

[CtrlAltDel]

But it never took schools to make a scientist.

The point is that we ourselves decide if we want to get an education. If we want, we can become Engineers without gaining an iota of knwoledge, or skip chool/college and still become a scientist.

the whole thing starts with schools. the interest in physics and other sciences start from school labs or from dedicated teachers. thats what produced great scientists in India. I dont see any other Abdul Kalam, Homi Baba, Sarabhai or Chidambaram in the near future.



even if anyone becomes a scientist, he/she wud most likely prefer working for the USA

[vakibs]

the whole thing starts with schools. the interest in physics and other sciences start from school labs or from dedicated teachers. thats what produced great scientists in India. I dont see any other Abdul Kalam, Homi Baba, Sarabhai or Chidambaram in the near future.
even if anyone becomes a scientist, he/she wud most likely prefer working for the USA

Sadly thats true It seems everybody is in a big marathon race to become a software engineer. Oh why the f u c k ! Oh why the f u c k !!

[Sharjeel]

But it never took schools to make a scientist.

The point is that we ourselves decide if we want to get an education. If we want, we can become Engineers without gaining an iota of knwoledge, or skip chool/college and still become a scientist.

the whole thing starts with schools. the interest in physics and other sciences start from school labs or from dedicated teachers. thats what produced great scientists in India. I dont see any other Abdul Kalam, Homi Baba, Sarabhai or Chidambaram in the near future.

even if anyone becomes a scientist, he/she wud most likely prefer working for the USA

Damn them and their Dollars/Pounds!



It certainly starts with schools. But it is also abut the inner drive to succeed, to make a difference. School can only make Sherry study, it cannot make Sherry think.

[mark]

But it never took schools to make a scientist.

The point is that we ourselves decide if we want to get an education. If we want, we can become Engineers without gaining an iota of knwoledge, or skip chool/college and still become a scientist.

the whole thing starts with schools. the interest in physics and other sciences start from school labs or from dedicated teachers. thats what produced great scientists in India. I dont see any other Abdul Kalam, Homi Baba, Sarabhai or Chidambaram in the near future.

even if anyone becomes a scientist, he/she wud most likely prefer working for the USA

Damn them and their Dollars/Pounds!

It certainly starts with schools. But it is also abut the inner drive to succeed, to make a difference. School can only make Sherry study, it cannot make Sherry think.

*corney german accent* ve haf vays of making you think!

*straps electrodes onto Sherry's skull*

[vakibs]

nope. sounds similar to our leaving certificate though, 2 years, 1 marathon round of exams, and a score from 0 - 600 which determines what university course you'll be able to do. 2 years of hell, made up for only by the drunken insanity that is 1st year in uni.

hmm.. I thought Irish schooldays should have had been much happier. Dont know why this stupidity persists everywhere though !!