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by Sharjeel » Sat Dec 18, 2004 3:48 pm

~akidna~ wrote:i dont knw for sure....but i guess ur a syed...if ur father is a syed
Right! I am a Mirza :D.



But even then, apart from the name, we get genes from our mothers and fathers. So, me was making a point in that direction, towards the fact that if my mom was a Syed, that would give me many of the qualities and traits of a Syed.
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by ~akidna~ » Sat Dec 18, 2004 3:58 pm

ok sharjeel mirza :lol:
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by RegisteredFinally » Sat Dec 18, 2004 9:16 pm

Well my paternal grand-dad and grand-mum both are from Amritsar. However my maternal great-grand-father was a very big land-lord. Although most of that property has been left on the other side of the border so it'll be really confusing for me to trace my ancestory.


hmm..interesting..i have like three or four relatives on the "other" side of the border but i think they are canadians now .. inever met them :?

Ahem... :? :shock: :? :shock:


hairat mat kariye...logon ke shijre hosakte :)

Right! I am a Mirza .

But even then, apart from the name, we get genes from our mothers and fathers. So, me was making a point in that direction, towards the fact that if my mom was a Syed, that would give me many of the qualities and traits of a Syed.


my mom's family has a shijrah.. im a "tarfain" syed ie both dad n mom are syed..but they dont keep records on my paternal side of the family :cry:

but i am a syed from mom's side for sure and they have the shijrah to prove it..but i wonder why arabs claim the rulers of Jordan are the only surviving descendants Hashemite clan :x :x

oh well....only our deeds matter in the end not our shijrahs

ok sharjeel mirza




heard from a shia frnd that a syed-nonsyed hybrid is a mirza..didn't know it was true :shock:



---

---

:roll:
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by CtrlAltDel » Sun Dec 19, 2004 11:47 am

RegisteredFinally wrote:but i am a syed from mom's side for sure and they have the shijrah to prove it..but i wonder why arabs claim the rulers of Jordan are the only surviving descendants Hashemite clan :x :x
:? now dont tell me u r a potential claimant for the throne in Jordan...:?
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by Mayavi Morpheus » Sun Dec 19, 2004 12:23 pm

Can someone enlighten me too.., I am mucho confused.

Arent syed, mirza etc family names? or is it some thing like reddy, naidu.. caste names :?

so you can trace your identity back to a single person/couple if you are syed or mirza? :?
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by Sharjeel » Sun Dec 19, 2004 12:48 pm

Some of the Last-Names are honorary (like Mirza and Quazi), while some are clan-name sort of thingies (like Syed) and have been carried on through centuries.



Thus, if I say that me is a Mirza, my ancestors may have been given tha name as a title, or, we may actually be descendants of the original Mirza couple/tribe, in which case, we can trace ourselves back.



RegisteredFinally wrote:my mom's family has a shijrah.. im a "tarfain" syed ie both dad n mom are syed..but they dont keep records on my paternal side of the family :cry:
Wow! a purebreed Syed!

heard from a shia frnd that a syed-nonsyed hybrid is a mirza..didn't know it was true :shock:
It is not! So u can rest easy :) .
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by Mayavi Morpheus » Sun Dec 19, 2004 1:01 pm

Sharjeel wrote:Some of the Last-Names are honorary (like Mirza and Quazi), while some are clan-name sort of thingies (like Syed) and have been carried on through centuries.

Thus, if I say that me is a Mirza, my ancestors may have been given tha name as a title, or, we may actually be descendants of the original Mirza couple/tribe, in which case, we can trace ourselves back.
.




Thanks sharjeel.

One more question, do they all come under the two muslim sects - shia and sunni or they are different?
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by Sharjeel » Sun Dec 19, 2004 1:09 pm

Welcome!



Shia/Sunni is the divide which took pace just after the demise of the lasst and most revered Prophet in Islam.



A lot of poitical in-fighting took place and the result was that now there is a patthar ki lakeer sort of divide in the muslim ranks.



The Shia say that Hadhrat Ali, the nephew of the Prophet Muhammad(SAWS) was divinely inspired and say that he is a prophet too, while the Sunni's mantain that the chain of prohet-hood finished with the demise of the last prophet Muhammad (SAWS).



Dont wanna step on anyones toes here, so I am sorry if my description is a little off.
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by Mayavi Morpheus » Sun Dec 19, 2004 1:15 pm

Hey, thanks again. I got the jist of it and I have few more questions. I wanted to start a topic about this, but I will ask here cos we are on topic anyway...

1) what is saws, s.w.a.t. I know pbuh.

2) who are ahmadis? And who is Imam mehdi(swas?)?

3) Have you heard about Gohar shahi http://www.goharshahi.com what do you thinks of it.
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by Sharjeel » Sun Dec 19, 2004 1:56 pm

SAWS is the arabic form of PBUH: Peace be upon him



saws, and sawt both mean: Peace be upon him(or you) with small variations.



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Here is a good definition of Ahmaddiya:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmaddiya



-------

I dont know anything about Mr. Shahi and what he preaches, but looks to be a sham, at first glance.





--------

This is taken from http://www.understanding-islam.com/related/text.asp?type=rarticle&raid=359, rearranged and edited...



It seems to be the correct as far as my knowledge goes:

------

Imam Mehdi:

Among the major signs of the Day of Judgment is the advent of Imam Mehdi. The Messenger of Allah (Sallallahu alayhi wasallam) predicted the coming of Imam Mehdi towards the end of this worldly existence, i.e. just before The Day of Judgment.



SIGNS BEFORE HIS APPEARANCE

The world will be filled with a great amount of injustice and oppression. There will be widespread evil in which all people will be heavily involved.



The Muslims would also be under severe persecution and oppression from the Khalifah (i.e. the Sufyaani) of that time and they will have no place to run.



The Ahl-ul-Bait (Family of Prophet Muhammad Sallallahu alayhi wasallam) will experience difficulties and persecution.



There will be a fight in Makkah between three people, each one being the son of a Khalifah, over leadership of the Muslims. However, none of them will gain the Khilafat. This fight will take place in the month of Zul-Qa'dah, and even in Mina during Hajj, there will be quarrelling. All this will occur in the same year as Imam Mahdi's election.



An army will come from the East towards Arabia. The East here refers to Khurasan, i.e. Afghanistan. They will pave the way for the establishment of Imam Mahdi's kingdom. This army will carry black banners. Nothing shall stop their onward march, and eventually they will plant their flag on the soils of Jerusalem.



--------

Hazrat Abu Hurayrah (radiyallahu anhu) narrates that the Messenger of Allah (Sallallahu alayhi wasallam) said:



"If only one day is left for the end of the world, Allah will lengthen that day until a man from my family, whose name will be the same as mine, rules the world." (Tirmizi Shareef)



This indicates the emphasis, which The Holy Messenger of Allah Sallallahu alayhi wasallam laid on the coming of Imam Mehdi.



The date and time of his arrival we leave to The Knowledge of Allah. However, the Messenger of Allah (Sallallahu alayhi wasallam) did give certain signs, which will herald the arrival of this great Imam. The sayings on this issue leave no room for rejecting or even doubting the coming of Imam Mehdi. Neither do the facts leave us in the dark as to recognizing this great Imam when he eventually does arrive.



----------

The term "MEHDI" is a title meaning "Guided one". The Mehdi is a normal man who is going to follow the true Islam. His name will be Muhammad and his father name will be Abdullah. He is a descendant from Ali and Fatima (daughter of the prophet Muhammad) so he will be descendant from al-Hasan or al-Hussain or both. The Mehdi will be very just and his capital will be Damascus. The Mehdi is NOT a prophet but he is the final Rightly Guided Khalifah. The Mehdi will lead Muslims to a great victory against the Sufyaani and the Romans. This great war or Armageddon. It will end up with a great victory to Muslims against Romans after six years. Muslims will take over their capital Rome (this can be any city). In the seventh year, the Dajjal (antichrist) will appear and a greater war will start between his followers and the believers for 40 days (longer that usual days) and will end when 'Eessa ("Jesus") will come, slay the Dajjal along with his followers. All remaining people will convert into Islam. Peace will pervade the whole world.



------

DETAILS OF IMAM MEHDI

The following are facts taken from the sayings of the Messenger of Allah( Sallallahu alayhi wasallam):



His name will be the same as that of (The Messenger of Allah Sallallahu alayhi wasallam), i.e. Muhammad. In addition, his father's name will be Abdullah. His title is the-Mehdi, meaning the guided one. The Holy Prophet Sallallahu alayhi wasallam also called him Khaleefatullah, meaning "the Deputy of Allah".



He will have the character and morals of the Messenger of Allah (Sallallahu alayhi wasallam). In one night Allah will grant him unique qualities of faith, piety, leadership and knowledge, hence the title Mehdi.



IMAM MAHDI'S EMERGENCE AS THE NEW KHALIFAH

Imam Mehdi will be inspired, and preparations will be made for him in one night to carry out his task successfully. They will actually lead him by the hand towards the Hijre Aswad, where people will then formally pledge their allegiance to him as the Khalifah. This pledge will take place in front of The Holy Ka 'ba, between the Hijre Aswad and the Muqame Ibrahim, during or just after the days of Hajj.



Initially the number of people to take the bay 'at pledge of allegiance at his hands will be 313, which is the number of Sahabah that took part in the battle of Badr. He will be forty years old at the time of his appointment.



PROTECTION AND ACCEPTANCE BY ALLAH

Immediately upon his appointment as the new Khalifah Imam Mehdi will witness the direct Help of Allah. Before the Mehdi, a man from the heart of Damascus, known as Sufyaani (from the family of Abu Sufyaan) had begun a horrendous campaign of bloodshed and killing, during which no tribe or community will be left alone. Even women and children will be mercilessly butchered. His chief supporters and followers will be the tribe of Kalb.



When this Sufyaani hears of Imam Mehdi, he will immediately dispatch an army towards Makkah (where the Mehdi will be). The Imam and his handful of followers will easily defeat this army. Then this Sufyaani will himself lead a contingent from Syria towards Makkah to fight against Imam Mehdi.



This army will be destroyed by an enormous earthquake at Baidaa, a place just after Zhul-Hulaifa, on the way to Makkah. First the rear of the army will be devastated, and when those in front go back to see what had happened, they too will meet the same fate. All but one member of this army will perish, and this sole survivor will take back the news of this disaster. There will be many in this army who had been brought along by force, people who did not intend to oppose Imam Mehdi. Such people would also be destroyed along with the others, but on the Day of Judgment they will be raised up according to their intentions. When the story of Divine Help being granted to Imam Mehdi spreads through the Muslim world, the Abdaals of Syria and the pious people of Iraq will come to pledge allegiance to Imam Mehdi and join his ranks.



Imam Mehdi then moves forward to Syria, where he fights the armies of the Sufyaani who has the backing of the tribe of Kalb. He too will send an army against Imam Mehdi, who will yet again, through The Grace of Allah, inflict heavy defeat on his enemies.



HIS LEADERSHIP, BATTLES AND ACHIEVEMENTS

With his army now bolstered by saintly and pious people Imam Mehdi will defeat his enemies, as we have seen in the initial battles mentioned above. Upon releasing Syria from the oppressive rule of the Sufyaani, whom he captures and executes, he regroups his forces there, and prepares to engage the oppressive Zionists in Jerusalem. He will fight them, and also release Jerusalem from their oppressive rule. All the lands Imam Mehdi conquers were before him under Tyranny and Oppression, which he replaces with Equity and Justice.



He will rule for seven to nine years, with complete justice and righteousness, and all this time Islam will be the predominant religion of the world.



During his rule, the Muslims will experience great economic enrichment. There will be no droughts and lands will be exceptionally fertile. The earth will yield crops in abundance and of the best quality. This rich agricultural state will ensure a glut of money and food. In fact, so much that people who come to the Baitul-Maal for assistance will be given as much as they can take away.



The hearts of people will become so independent of wealth and so dependent on Allah that when an announcement is made for the needy to come forward, only one person will stand up. When this person will be given wealth in such abundance, he will feel ashamed and would want to return the wealth, but the answer will be: "We do not take back what has been given. It's all yours to keep."



-----

Imam Mehdi will conquer the city of Constantinople (presently known as Istanbul). The story behind this conquest is as follows:



After the earthquakes, which destroyed his enemies, and the subsequent amassing of Muslim armies under his leadership, the Imam will leave Makkah for Madina, where he will offer salaam at the Rozah Mubarak (The Grave of The Messenger of Allah Sallallahu alayhi wasallam).



Having done this his next step would be to proceed on to Damascus, where the bulk of the Nasara (Christian) forces along with the tribe of Kalb would be deployed, as was previously mentioned.



In Damascus, the Imam will set up his headquarters. From here, he will conduct military operations against the enemies of Islam and defeats them (such as the ones in Jerusalem), and from here, he will rule.



In response to this, the Roman forces will attack, and destroy the city of the Prophet (Madina), and start to gather their forces against its inhabitants.



At a place known as either A 'maaq or Daabiq, somewhere near Allepo Syria, 960,000 Roman forces would be assembled under 80 banners representing 80 nations, quite clearly to annihilate the Muslims.



Imam Mehdi will send a battalion of Muslim fighters, from among the best people on earth, to engage them. When the two groups encounter each other face to face, the Romans will request that the Muslims hand over to them those who had fought and captured their Roman brethren. The Muslims will refuse, saying: "By Allah, We will never hand over our Muslim brothers" thus triggering off a fierce battle. A third of the Muslim army will flee, and Allah will never ever grant them Taubah (repentance). A third will be slain, and they will be the noblest martyrs in The Sight of Allah. The surviving third will be victorious, never to suffer defeat thereafter.



This battle will last four days. Each day the Muslim troops will resolve on oath that they will not return but as victors. For three days, they will fail to crush the enemy, with many men becoming martyrs. On the fourth day, the Christians will falter and succumb to a tremendous onslaught from the remaining Muslim troops. The ensuing slaughter will be unprecedented in history. This decimation will utterly shatter the morale of the Romans.



Pressing forward, the next destination will be Turkey. From the Syrian coast, Imam Mehdi will dispatch seventy thousand soldiers of the Banu Is-Haq tribe to re-conquer Istanbul, liberating it from Roman rule. They will cross the Mediterranean Sea, bound for Turkey and will conquer Istanbul without the use of a single weapon. Parts of the city will collapse upon the Takbeer and Tahleel of these warriors. They will recite' Laa ilaha illal-laahu wallahu Akbar' and simply walk over the city. The Muazhzhins of the Muslims will then establish the five times daily Azaan throughout the city.



------------------

This conquest will deliver untold fortunes into the hands of the Muslims. As he and his men busy themselves capturing and rounding up these vast riches a rumor will spread that "the Dajjal has broken loose in Syria and is wreaking havoc among your families." This news will be very disturbing to the Imam, and so consequently, he will hurriedly leave for Syria. In the meantime, ten men will be sent ahead to ascertain the truth. About these ten The Holy Prophet (Sallallahu alayhi wasallam) said: " I know their names and the names of their fathers they will be among the best warriors in that era." Prophet e Kareem (Sallallahu alayhi wasallam) even knew the color of their horses.



One of them will report that the whole story is false. Dajjal has not yet emerged. This was a lie fabricated by Shaitan/Evil to try and disrupt the progress of the Muslims. Imam Mehdi will resume his return journey to Syria with greater ease and comfort once he learns that Dajjal is not yet loose.



A few weeks after Imam Mehdi reaches Damascus the great imposter, Dajjal will now truly emerge and begin his campaign of mischief and corruption between Syria and Iraq.



Since the Dajjal will have a large following of mainly Jews and illegitimate people (those born out of marriage), the Muslims under Imam Mehdi will resume preparations for war. They will be busy arranging the formation of their troops during the time of Fajr. The Jama'at Salat will be almost about to start when suddenly Sayyidina Eessa (Alayhis salaam) son of Maryam will descend from the heavens and join the ranks of Muslims for Salat. He will lead the Fajr Salat.



After the slaying of Dajjal by Prophet Eessa, Imam Mehdi will not live for very long. A few months will elapse and this great Imam, a man who provided the perfect sequel to Allah's Supreme Religion -ISLAM, will pass on to the realms of the hereafter. The Muslims will perform his Janazah Salat and bury him, and the Messiah son of Maryam will then become the new ruler of the Muslims.

---------



Here is a good (looks to be good) url on the signs of the day of judgement:

http://www.inter-islam.org/faith/Majorsigns.html



------

Keep oin mind that this may look illogical and story-like. Please respect the sentiments of muslims (i know you people will!)
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by Mayavi Morpheus » Sun Dec 19, 2004 2:20 pm

That was a good read sharjeel!



Now I understand the whole story and the goharshahi thing too.



I met this guy in a chat room, claiming to be from delhi, and he was advertising the gohar shahi site... he sent me a pm and started telling me about gohar shahi. He claimed that he is imam mehdi and talked about all the signs.

Then suddenly he said that hinduism and Islam both are crap :shock: and asked me to follow Gohar shahi.

I didnt understand much of what he was saying as he was writing in pure urdu which I dont understand. Finally I realised that he was a pakistani. Was a nice chap though.
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by Sharjeel » Sun Dec 19, 2004 2:25 pm

Mayavi Morpheus wrote:I didnt understand much of what he was saying as he was writing in pure urdu which I dont understand. Finally I realised that he was a pakistani. Was a nice chap though.
Thats the problem with Paki people. They are so nice, but always seem to be doing something outlandish. Never living in the normal plane.



Saari duniya ko badal daloonga, seems to be their mantra.



Youi are welcome, MM. I seem to be gaining as much knowledge from you questions. So, let me Thank You!
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by CtrlAltDel » Sun Dec 19, 2004 3:57 pm

i remember Alexis saying that her family are the followers of Mehdi...thats how she also discovered a cousin in these boards! :D
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whoa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

by Bint Al-Hind » Sun Dec 19, 2004 9:01 pm

:shock: :shock: kahaan se kahaan chale gayi aaplogon ki baaten!



:? now dont tell me u r a potential claimant for the throne in Jordan... :?


dang! i love your retorts :D

k k guess what..i WAS the heiress to the throne until last week..but then i grew impatient because dem kings live long.. i forced king abdullah to abdicate the throne (theres bad blood between him and his lil brother n he had no back up) and proclaimed myself to be the Queeen of Jordan

first i was gonna do it all alone but then i figured taking my kin fellow hashemite akidna with me for backup wont be such a bad idea
i drugged and dragged her (jk jk jk)to the palace and now she is first in line to the throne**..i mean she is sick of school anyways

soon im gonna write to PM Singh and recommend him to appoint you the Indian ambassador to Jordan ..hang in there.. i will provide you the booze (darn arab monarchies :x ) and the girls (darn again)
No dont panick! they don't blow up indian embassies there..it happens only in south asia
infact the indian embassy is much safer than the saudi or kuwaiti embassy
and arabs love indians too for all their meekness honesty and hardwork..they trust you guyz more than they do us the indian muslims :roll:

hmm and im gonna have my share of fun too..first im gonna marry hisham abbas then divorce him then it will be amro diab , then divorce him then its tarkan- divorce, then a gora-gora bosnian then divorce then finally settle with an amreekan convert ...preferably a kallu
(i mean i gotta prove to my subjects that im an arab too right and my marriage-divorce spree will do that)

k k wishful thinking right...i hope you realized it was only my bakwaas , but it dont hurt to dream right.. Abdullah is hte "direct descendant" of Hashem ...it's gonna take a lot of effort to explain how that works so take my word and his lineage has nothing to do with him being the king of jordan

all our ancestors were from africa.... :D




i sooo wanna see you depose Mugabe

jk jk jk



**PS @ her highness the crown princess akidna: this decision was made assuming that i am older.. i will gladly switch positions if otherwise



:roll: :roll:
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Re: whoa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

by CtrlAltDel » Mon Dec 20, 2004 2:09 pm

Bint Al-Hind wrote:soon im gonna write to PM Singh and recommend him to appoint you the Indian ambassador to Jordan ..hang in there.. i will provide you the booze (darn arab monarchies :x ) and the girls (darn again)
cooooool! :P your highness, i'll be eternally indebted to u if that hapns! :D 8)
Bint Al-Hind wrote:i sooo wanna see you depose Mugabe
sure...y not....i was thinking of buying a small country anyway...why not conquor one? with yr financial backup i am also ready to overthrow ol' Dubya :D





btw, wats a "Bint Al-Hind"...???
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by Sharjeel » Mon Dec 20, 2004 2:35 pm

Bint means 'Daughter of'
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by CtrlAltDel » Mon Dec 20, 2004 2:47 pm

and "Al-Hind"...? anything to do with India?
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by Registered » Mon Dec 20, 2004 9:08 pm

alhind is india in arabic

:roll:



i remember Alexis saying that her family are the followers of Mehdi...thats how she also discovered a cousin in these boards! :D




k k i know im nosy :oops: but who is the sisters' cousin?



:roll:
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by Sharjeel » Mon Dec 20, 2004 9:20 pm

Registered wrote:alhind is india in arabic :roll:
:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: You rolled yer eyes at Goddy!?!?!
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by stupid reg » Mon Dec 20, 2004 9:25 pm

Sharjeel wrote:
Registered wrote:alhind is india in arabic :roll:
:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: You rolled yer eyes at Goddy!?!?!




oops that was supposed to be the end of my post phir achanak doosra sawaal yaad aaya..i forgot to backspace the rolleyes smiley :o



Sorry Cad

didnt mean to roll my eyes at you :evil: :x





---

---

---

:roll:
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by reg » Mon Dec 20, 2004 9:51 pm

Registered wrote:
k k i know im nosy :oops: but who is the sisters' cousin?

:roll:
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by Alexis » Mon Dec 20, 2004 10:27 pm

reg wrote:
Registered wrote:
k k i know im nosy :oops: but who is the sisters' cousin?

:roll:


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by CtrlAltDel » Mon Dec 20, 2004 10:29 pm

stupid reg wrote:
Sharjeel wrote:
Registered wrote:alhind is india in arabic :roll:
:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: You rolled yer eyes at Goddy!?!?!
Sorry Cad
didnt mean to roll my eyes at you :evil: :x
:D hey! its ok! i dont mind girls rolling their eyes at me...:D
wtf? i no longer care if my posts hurt yr feelings :roll:
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by PaSt_pReSeNt_FuTuRe » Wed Jan 05, 2005 6:57 pm

~akidna~ wrote:oh yeh ....even i have ancestors who descended from russia afghanitan from middle east....all mixed up...lol

but fortunately i dont have to prepare a geneology chart....our family has this thing called the "shijrah"....it contains details about births deaths marraiges n stuff datin back to the time of Adam A.S....to Gause Pak...to i guess the last ones to be entered in that was my mom n her siblings...we still aint in it...but its all in urdu or arabic...




thtz really kewl ... umm wish someone would've done tht for ma family..tht way i'd have found out bout ma ancestorz..n all n da long lost...distinct relativez n stuff , they'd prolly b less irritatin then da onez close by! :wink:
Ahh...wHo Da BlOoDy HelL...CaReZ..!?!
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by salamehyderabad » Wed Jan 05, 2005 9:51 pm

hmmmmmmmm.....pure frm rayalseema....only change born n bought up in hydieeeeee
Don't expect to learn about people from books; a person can't fit in a bookcase
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