streak o blood, rip the petal of you cheek...Dr Nurit Peled

[DQ]

INTERNATIONAL WOMENS DAY





The following is the speech Nurit Peled-Elhanan delivered at the European Parliament, Strasbourg, on March 8 on the occasion of International Women's Day





Thank you for inviting me to this day. It is always an honor and a pleasure to be here, among you.



However, I must admit I believe you should have invited a Palestinian woman at my stead, because the women who suffer most from violence in my county are the Palestinian women. And I would like to dedicate my speech to Miriam R'aban and her husband Kamal, from Bet Lahiya in the Gaza Strip, whose five small children were killed by Israeli soldiers while picking strawberries at the family's strawberry field. No one will ever stand trial for this murder.



When I asked the people who invited me here why wouldn't they invite a Palestinian woman the answer was that it would make the discussion too localized.



I don't know what is non-localized violence. Racism and discrimination may be theoretical concepts and universal phenomena but their impact is always local, and real. Pain is local, humiliation, sexual abuse, torture and death, are all very local, and so are the scars.



It is true unfortunately, that the local violence inflicted on Palestinian women by the government of Israel and the Israeli Army, has expanded around the globe. In fact state violence and army violence, individual and collective violence are the lot of Muslim women today, not only in Palestine but wherever the enlightened Western world is setting its big imperialistic foot. It is violence which is hardly ever addressed and which is halfheartedly condoned by most people in Europe and in the USA.



This is because the so-called free world is afraid of the Muslim womb.



Great France of la liberté l'égalité et la fraternité is scared of little girls with headscarves, Great Jewish Israel is afraid of the Muslim womb. Its ministers call it a demographic threat. Almighty America and Great Britain are infecting their respective citizens with blind fear of the Muslims, who are depicted as vile, primitive and blood-thirsty, apart from their being non-democratic, chauvinistic and mass producers of future terrorists.



This in spite of the fact that the people who are destroying the world today are not Muslim. One of them is a devout Christian, one is Anglican and one is a non-devout Jew.



I have never experienced the suffering Palestinian women undergo every day, every hour. I don't know the kind of violence that turns a woman's life into constant hell. This daily physical and mental torture of women who are deprived of their basic human rights and needs of privacy and dignity, women whose homes are broken in at any moment of day and night, who are ordered at a gun-point to strip naked in front of strangers and their own children, whose houses are demolished, who are deprived of their livelihood and of any normal family life. This is not part of my personal ordeal. But I am a victim of violence against women insofar as violence against children is actually violence against mothers. Palestinian, Iraqi, Afghan women are my sisters because we are all at the grip of the same unscrupulous criminals who call themselves leaders of the free enlightened world and in the name of this freedom and enlightenment rob us of our children. Furthermore, Israeli, American, Italian and British mothers have been for the most part violently blinded and brainwashed to such a degree that they cannot realize their only sisters, their only allies in the world are the Muslim Palestinian, Iraqi or Afghani mothers, whose children are killed by our children or who blow themselves to pieces with our sons and daughters. They are all mind-infected by the same viruses engendered by politicians. And the viruses, though they may have various illustrious names such as Democracy, Patriotism, God, Homeland, are all the same. They are all part of false and fake ideologies that are meant to enrich the rich and to empower the powerful.



We are all the victims of mental, psychological and cultural violence that turn us to one homogenic group of bereaved or potentially bereaved mothers. Western mothers are taught to believe their uterus is a national asset just like they are taught to believe that the Muslim uterus is an international threat. They are educated not to cry out: "I gave him birth, I breast-fed him, he is mine, and I will not let him be the one whose life is cheaper than oil, whose future is less worth than a piece of land."



All of us are terrorized by mind-infecting education to believe all we can do is either pray for our sons to come back home or be proud of their dead bodies.



And all of us were brought up to bear all this silently, to contain our fear and frustration, to take Prozac for anxiety, but never hail Mama Courage in public. Never be real Jewish or Italian or Irish mothers.



I am a victim of state violence. My natural and civil rights as a mother have been violated and are violated because I have to fear the day my son would reach his 18th birthday and be taken away from me to be the game tool of criminals such as Sharon, Bush, Blair and their clan of blood-thirsty, oil-thirsty, land-thirsty generals.



Living in the world I live in, in the state I live in, in the regime I live in, I don't dare to offer Muslim women any ideas how to change their lives. I don't want them to take off their scarves, or educate their children differently, and I will not urge them to constitute democracies in the image of Western democracies that despise them and their kind. I just want to ask them humbly to be my sisters, to express my admiration for their perseverance and for their courage to carry on, to have children and to maintain a dignified family life in spite of the impossible conditions my world is putting them in. I want to tell them we are all bonded by the same pain, we are all the victims of the same sort of violence even though they suffer much more, for they are the ones who are mistreated by my government and its army, sponsored by my taxes.



Islam in itself, like Judaism in itself and Christianity in itself, is not a threat to me or to anyone. American imperialism is, European indifference and cooperation is and Israeli racist and cruel regime of occupation is. It is racism, educational propaganda and inculcated xenophobia that convince Israeli soldiers to order Palestinian women at gun-point to strip in front of their children for security reasons; it is the deepest disrespect for the other that allow American soldiers to rape Iraqi women, that give license to Israeli jailers to keep young women in inhuman conditions, without necessary hygienic aids, without electricity in the winter, without clean water or clean mattresses and to separate them from their breast-fed babies and toddlers. To bar their way to hospitals, to block their way to education, to confiscate their lands, to uproot their trees and prevent them from cultivating their fields.



I cannot completely understand Palestinian women or their suffering. I don't know how I would have survived such humiliation, such disrespect from the whole world. All I know is that the voice of mothers has been suffocated for too long in this war-stricken planet . Mothers' cry is not heard because mothers are not invited to international forums such as this one. This I know and it is very little. But it is enough for me to remember these women are my sisters, and that they deserve that I should cry for them, and fight for them. And when they lose their children in strawberry fields or in on filthy roads by the checkpoints, when their children are shot on their way to school by Israeli children who were educated to believe that love and compassion are race- and religion-dependent, the only thing I can do is stand by them and their betrayed babies, and ask what Anna Akhmatova, another mother who lived in a regime of violence against women and children, had asked:



Why does that streak o blood, rip the petal of you cheek?

[Sharjeel]

Did not read a single line. Will do so when I am finished watching paint dry.



Lighten up, man! Nobody will read such a long post, even though they may care. It is about doing, and not just talking/posting.

[DQ]

The best you can do is live in peace and not be indifferent to others beleives and practices.



Dont know what context you mean Lighten up ?



Is it the pet factor ?



What is Pet factor, most of us have become like the pet dogs. Throw a bone and we are contend. One series of cricket and we forget about the millions that suffer. If lighten up was for this, then this darker side of realisation is better then the lighter side of indifference

[Sharjeel]

The best you can do is live in peace and not be indifferent to others beleives and practices.

Dont know what context you mean Lighten up ?

Is it the pet factor ?

Only God has the power to recognize and reward good intentions, but for the rest of us humans, it is much better if we find a relevant place to convey a message.



Making such long posts will do nothing more than get replies from 'pet dogs' like me.



Sirf lambe post kare to kya aap achhe insaan ban jaate? that is what I meant, when I said that it is not just the talk. You have to walk the talk.



I can keep playin' this replying game, because I alsmost have as much free time as you seemd to be having.

[DQ]

Apne free time me thoda pehli line pado, yeh kahin se copy paste hain. Agar aap ko koi interest nahi hain padne me to kahin aur time pass karo.

[Sharjeel]

Apne free time me thoda pehli line pado, yeh kahin se copy paste hain. Agar aap ko koi interest nahi hain padne me to kahin aur time pass karo.

Me got nothing against you, just wanted you to stop wasting your time. Har cheez ki ek jagah rehti, ek time rehta aur ek style rehta. Akele khade rehke cheeqne se kuchh nai milta.



I read your first line, and that is what made me post the line about good intentions. The only people who will respond to your thread are you-know-who, culminating in a lot of slander, and further tarnishing the image of your favorite religion. Apne hathon se apnaich nuksaan karrae...



If you want to change things, you have to start with yourself. You have to put across your views, do it in a style which is appropriate for this forum.



Forum ke kone mein post pe post kare jaarae, koi padta nai to kya faeda?

[You-Know-who]

Here I am

Was my presence being missed?

I think FH should have a new "Middle East Mehfil" section along with the "Dakhni Mehfil" section as it seems that we are more concerned with middle eastern affairs than Hyderabadi or Indian affairs.

[DQ]

Hmm okai point taken Sharjeel.



But 1 your presumption about walk the talk. as a presumption its good may not be a fact.



On kya milta, this has been an eye opener to me to see the radical side of of the so called "secular" bajaist.



I have millions of mates more non - favorite religions then favorite relegion ones.

Had never come across such radicals who take pleasure in the troubles of others and these discussions are an eye opener on how events like gujrat take place. It is the hate factor that is being spread.



Now why Middle east is being discussed here, well an Isareli woman speaks on "International Womens day" in Europe on the plight of philistine women. Its more of an information post.



The plight of the Women has to be highlighted, the so called "political messiahs" of today have made this a tool as Nurit quotes "Great France of la liberté l'égalité et la fraternité is scared of little girls with headscarves, Great Jewish Israel is afraid of the Muslim womb. Its ministers call it a demographic threat. Almighty America and Great Britain are infecting their respective citizens with blind fear of the Muslims, who are depicted as vile, primitive and blood-thirsty, apart from their being non-democratic, chauvinistic and mass producers of future terrorists. "



and exactly what happened in our very own Gujrat



http://www.hindu.com/mag/2003/12/28/sto ... 210300.htm



Its time to awaken and shrug these politicians and demonistaion of people, before we anihilate ourselves.

[parinda]

If you want to change things, you have to start with yourself. You have to put across your views, do it in a style which is appropriate for this forum.

And whats that style exactly does it look like "da hindooism " is that the style you are impressed with, if there are sladerers around it doesnt mean that you dont post ,becuase the slanderers slander only for the sake of sladering ,fundamentalists(Hindutva follwing Hindus) cannot keep people away from expressing their opinions.

[Sharjeel]

Yep, parinda man! I am a hindu(stani) .

But 1 your presumption about walk the talk. as a presumption its good may not be a fact.

On kya milta, this has been an eye opener to me to see the radical side of of the so called "secular" bajaist.

It was not a presumption, it is a conclusion drawn by the fact that I have seen you do nothing than paost hate against all other religions except your own.



This is a forum which is frequented by people who like each other, and do not intend to kill or maim anyone, so your 'eye opening' posts turn into an 'eye-sore'.



No eye openings anywhere, only thing these posts do, it to make people run away from FH.

[Generation longing for Peace]

My home is Taybeh, a village between Jerusalem and Jericho, not far from Ramallah. Taybeh received its present name during Salahdin's visit in the 12th century. Its earlier name, Ephraim, is mentioned in the New Testament: "Jesus therefore walked no more openly among the Jews; but went thence unto a country near the wilderness, into a city called Ephraim." (John 11:54). Christians have lived here since the time of Christ.

As a child growing up in America, I didn't realize there were still Christians in the Holy Land -- I imagined only Jews and Muslims. It wasn't until I was a student at Hellenic College, where I met my husband, David Khoury, himself a Palestinian, that I began to hear about Christianity's living presence in the places mentioned in the Gospel.

It was David's idea that we build our lives in the Holy Land. He assured me that Taybeh, a Christian village where he grew up and in which everyone is related, would be the best place in the world to raise responsible children. We moved there in 1996.

Indeed, in the climate of hope created by the Oslo Peace Agreement, raising children in such a setting presented itself as a wonderful opportunity for them -- a wholesome upbringing in a land of promise. In many ways Taybeh proved to be a better place to raise children than the United States. In Taybeh we avoid Saturday night parties because everyone in Taybeh visits their relatives on Saturday night. Here children are never tempted by peers to experiment with drugs -- drugs are not available on the West Bank. There are be no appeals from children to miss church on Sunday in order to attend a soccer game -- here there are no sports events when it's time for church. Here we avoid shopping malls and a culture of self-obsessed materialism. The children have the blessing of a close-knit extended family that, sadly, many Americans have lost.

Returning to his homeland is the dream of every Palestinian father. David talked the family into building a microbrewery in Taybeh that would support the family while strengthening the Palestinian economy.

"Taybeh Beer" is the first Palestinian beer and the only microbrewery in the Middle East. The new beer was so successful that it made history in Palestine -- the first and only Palestinian product to be franchised and brewed in Germany under the Taybeh Beer license. Hundreds of newspapers articles were written as reporters were so curious about these people who invest millions of dollars to produce beer in an area where 98 percent of the population is Muslim. The resourceful persons behind all this are my husband and his brother, Nadim. They invested their heart, soul and savings to help build up Palestine. Receiving Arafat's blessing for the brewery was also an indication that a democratic Palestinian state would have room for a Christian minority.

Then came Sharon's fateful visit to the Temple Mount in Jerusalem on September 28, 2000, and the new Intifada began. We have experienced 18 months of destruction -- bombings, assassinations, countless buildings demolished, and the killing of hundreds of unarmed civilians, among these my dear nephew, Ibrahim, an altar boy shot through the heart because he happened to be at the wrong place at the wrong time.

We have watched as many families packed up their belongings and left for other countries leaving behind hotels they built, battery factories they created, health clinics they established. They gave up the dream of helping rebuild their homeland and living in the land of promise.

Sometimes I can't understand my husband's decision to stay. How can he run a beer factory when the bottles he needs are stuck at the Israeli port due to red tape? The fees and storage costs are more than the bottles are worth. A 40 percent production tax cripples you as a new business. Israeli's war against the Palestinian economy is an entire story by itself.

"What does all this mean to you as a mother in your daily life?" relatives and friends in America ask me. I will just give one example.

Every day there is the issue of trying to find a way to get our children to school. I normally take nine children (three are my own) back and forth to Ramallah in our van. Ramallah is close on the map but sometimes as far away as the moon because of so many obstacles. You get up, get dressed, try to find out if the schools are open that day, then try to find a way to school. Sometimes you make all the preparations only to discover at the last moment that the schools have been closed for the day by military order, or you find that the school is open but the roads are closed. Sometimes you make it all the way to school, passing through many checkpoints -- at least four -- only to find school was cancelled because of a funeral or protest. Sometimes while in school, a bomb goes off in Israel, with the result that you cannot get back home. The stress is sometimes unbearable.

Today at one checkpoint I saw the children ordered out of the van and lined up like criminals, a machine gun pointing at them while the heavily-armed soldier kept his finger on the trigger. Meanwhile I handed over their passports for inspection, as I have done countless times.

Never in my 20 years of traveling in and out of this region have I seen the soldiers so frightened and so intense as at present. Today I wondered if the violence has so traumatized this particular young soldier with the machine gun that he has lost his ability to treat mothers and children in a humane way?

I hated to see my children and nieces made to stand shoulder to shoulder as if for a police line-up. We were only three minutes from our home -- so close after such a long and hard school day. "Are you kidding?" I asked the soldier. "Why do you want the children to get out of the car?" But one of my children said, "Mom, please don't argue. He has a gun. We are used to this." In fact no one ever gets used to this. The youngest child was shaking so badly she could hardly get out of the van.

In the face of such cruel treatment of civilians day after day, is it surprising that some desperate young people become terrorists? For so many young people, just going back and forth to school is often a nightmare experience.

Every day we try a new way to school because each day the situation changes. Sometimes we discover at the last stage that a tank is blocking the way. All we can do is turn around and try some other dirt road. The result of so many obstacles and detours along routes never intended for cars is that all our vehicles are damaged. The main roads for Palestinians have been closed since September 28, 2000. The back roads are full of rock and holes. A ride that would take only 15 minutes in peaceful times can now take four hours.

Not many days ago Israeli tanks were in the heart of Ramallah. Now the tanks are withdrawn to the outskirts, poised to reoccupy the town at any moment.

Meanwhile Palestinian towns and villages remain cut off from each other. We feel as if we are being strangled by the endless military presence.

As an American, I find it ironic each day to have American weapons aimed at me and my children. The weapons and money the United States sends Israel are not being used for Israel's security but to ethnically cleanse the Holy Land of its native people. American military aid is being used to deny three million people their human rights, a collective punishment so severe that it becomes humiliating just to send children to school.

The situation will improve only when Israel ends its 35-year-old occupation of Palestinian territories. It is not possible to have peace and occupation at the same time. The Palestinian Authority recognized Israel on 78 percent of historic Palestine. It is Israel that refuses to acknowledge Palestine's right to exist on the remaining 22 percent of the land occupied in l967.

The continuing enlargement of illegal Israeli settlements in the West Bank and Gaza makes peace more elusive. Today there are about 250,000 settlers on Palestinian territories, many of them heavily armed, all living under army protection. The biggest settlement happens to be right next to Taybeh.

It is facts like this that create suicide bombers.

Is it any wonder that the Christian community in the land of Christ's birth is shrinking? Families decide to emigrate because they see no hope for their children here. What is surprising is not that so many people have left, but that so many still remain. But we who remain have to pay a very high price.

I write this in the first week of the Orthodox Lenten period. I pray we can open our hearts to Christ so that he can to fill us with his love and everlasting hope so that we will have the strength to remain in the land of his birth, bearing witness to the possibility of Christians, Muslims and Jews living and prospering together. I believe there are enough of us who are not fanatics and only want to raise a generation of children in peace.

[Generation longing for Peace]

My home is Taybeh, a village between Jerusalem and Jericho, not far from Ramallah. Taybeh received its present name during Salahdin's visit in the 12th century. Its earlier name, Ephraim, is mentioned in the New Testament: "Jesus therefore walked no more openly among the Jews; but went thence unto a country near the wilderness, into a city called Ephraim." (John 11:54). Christians have lived here since the time of Christ.

As a child growing up in America, I didn't realize there were still Christians in the Holy Land -- I imagined only Jews and Muslims. It wasn't until I was a student at Hellenic College, where I met my husband, David Khoury, himself a Palestinian, that I began to hear about Christianity's living presence in the places mentioned in the Gospel.

It was David's idea that we build our lives in the Holy Land. He assured me that Taybeh, a Christian village where he grew up and in which everyone is related, would be the best place in the world to raise responsible children. We moved there in 1996.

Indeed, in the climate of hope created by the Oslo Peace Agreement, raising children in such a setting presented itself as a wonderful opportunity for them -- a wholesome upbringing in a land of promise. In many ways Taybeh proved to be a better place to raise children than the United States. In Taybeh we avoid Saturday night parties because everyone in Taybeh visits their relatives on Saturday night. Here children are never tempted by peers to experiment with drugs -- drugs are not available on the West Bank. There are be no appeals from children to miss church on Sunday in order to attend a soccer game -- here there are no sports events when it's time for church. Here we avoid shopping malls and a culture of self-obsessed materialism. The children have the blessing of a close-knit extended family that, sadly, many Americans have lost.

Returning to his homeland is the dream of every Palestinian father. David talked the family into building a microbrewery in Taybeh that would support the family while strengthening the Palestinian economy.

"Taybeh Beer" is the first Palestinian beer and the only microbrewery in the Middle East. The new beer was so successful that it made history in Palestine -- the first and only Palestinian product to be franchised and brewed in Germany under the Taybeh Beer license. Hundreds of newspapers articles were written as reporters were so curious about these people who invest millions of dollars to produce beer in an area where 98 percent of the population is Muslim. The resourceful persons behind all this are my husband and his brother, Nadim. They invested their heart, soul and savings to help build up Palestine. Receiving Arafat's blessing for the brewery was also an indication that a democratic Palestinian state would have room for a Christian minority.

Then came Sharon's fateful visit to the Temple Mount in Jerusalem on September 28, 2000, and the new Intifada began. We have experienced 18 months of destruction -- bombings, assassinations, countless buildings demolished, and the killing of hundreds of unarmed civilians, among these my dear nephew, Ibrahim, an altar boy shot through the heart because he happened to be at the wrong place at the wrong time.

We have watched as many families packed up their belongings and left for other countries leaving behind hotels they built, battery factories they created, health clinics they established. They gave up the dream of helping rebuild their homeland and living in the land of promise.

Sometimes I can't understand my husband's decision to stay. How can he run a beer factory when the bottles he needs are stuck at the Israeli port due to red tape? The fees and storage costs are more than the bottles are worth. A 40 percent production tax cripples you as a new business. Israeli's war against the Palestinian economy is an entire story by itself.

"What does all this mean to you as a mother in your daily life?" relatives and friends in America ask me. I will just give one example.

Every day there is the issue of trying to find a way to get our children to school. I normally take nine children (three are my own) back and forth to Ramallah in our van. Ramallah is close on the map but sometimes as far away as the moon because of so many obstacles. You get up, get dressed, try to find out if the schools are open that day, then try to find a way to school. Sometimes you make all the preparations only to discover at the last moment that the schools have been closed for the day by military order, or you find that the school is open but the roads are closed. Sometimes you make it all the way to school, passing through many checkpoints -- at least four -- only to find school was cancelled because of a funeral or protest. Sometimes while in school, a bomb goes off in Israel, with the result that you cannot get back home. The stress is sometimes unbearable.

Today at one checkpoint I saw the children ordered out of the van and lined up like criminals, a machine gun pointing at them while the heavily-armed soldier kept his finger on the trigger. Meanwhile I handed over their passports for inspection, as I have done countless times.

Never in my 20 years of traveling in and out of this region have I seen the soldiers so frightened and so intense as at present. Today I wondered if the violence has so traumatized this particular young soldier with the machine gun that he has lost his ability to treat mothers and children in a humane way?

I hated to see my children and nieces made to stand shoulder to shoulder as if for a police line-up. We were only three minutes from our home -- so close after such a long and hard school day. "Are you kidding?" I asked the soldier. "Why do you want the children to get out of the car?" But one of my children said, "Mom, please don't argue. He has a gun. We are used to this." In fact no one ever gets used to this. The youngest child was shaking so badly she could hardly get out of the van.

In the face of such cruel treatment of civilians day after day, is it surprising that some desperate young people become terrorists? For so many young people, just going back and forth to school is often a nightmare experience.

Every day we try a new way to school because each day the situation changes. Sometimes we discover at the last stage that a tank is blocking the way. All we can do is turn around and try some other dirt road. The result of so many obstacles and detours along routes never intended for cars is that all our vehicles are damaged. The main roads for Palestinians have been closed since September 28, 2000. The back roads are full of rock and holes. A ride that would take only 15 minutes in peaceful times can now take four hours.

Not many days ago Israeli tanks were in the heart of Ramallah. Now the tanks are withdrawn to the outskirts, poised to reoccupy the town at any moment.

Meanwhile Palestinian towns and villages remain cut off from each other. We feel as if we are being strangled by the endless military presence.

As an American, I find it ironic each day to have American weapons aimed at me and my children. The weapons and money the United States sends Israel are not being used for Israel's security but to ethnically cleanse the Holy Land of its native people. American military aid is being used to deny three million people their human rights, a collective punishment so severe that it becomes humiliating just to send children to school.

The situation will improve only when Israel ends its 35-year-old occupation of Palestinian territories. It is not possible to have peace and occupation at the same time. The Palestinian Authority recognized Israel on 78 percent of historic Palestine. It is Israel that refuses to acknowledge Palestine's right to exist on the remaining 22 percent of the land occupied in l967.

The continuing enlargement of illegal Israeli settlements in the West Bank and Gaza makes peace more elusive. Today there are about 250,000 settlers on Palestinian territories, many of them heavily armed, all living under army protection. The biggest settlement happens to be right next to Taybeh.

It is facts like this that create suicide bombers.

Is it any wonder that the Christian community in the land of Christ's birth is shrinking? Families decide to emigrate because they see no hope for their children here. What is surprising is not that so many people have left, but that so many still remain. But we who remain have to pay a very high price.

I write this in the first week of the Orthodox Lenten period. I pray we can open our hearts to Christ so that he can to fill us with his love and everlasting hope so that we will have the strength to remain in the land of his birth, bearing witness to the possibility of Christians, Muslims and Jews living and prospering together. I believe there are enough of us who are not fanatics and only want to raise a generation of children in peace.

[sp]

Yep, parinda man! I am a hindu(stani) .

you wanted to sound politically correct so you added (stani) after mentioning your religion..there might be mulsim readership here, but really you have got nothing to be scared of



that's what zakir nike too said in one of his speeches that he is a hindu because he lives in india. the term hindu has nothing to do with religion. `hindu` just identifies the geographic location of the `hindu` person in question



you wanted to put across the point that you don't openly profess your religion and want to be seen as a modern secularist.. ok! we get your point and people you wanted to make happy are happy that you don't identify with your religion and are a modern secularist. way to go with the flow! you are on the verge of identity crisis



so adding (stani) was not really necessary. People will get what you mean even if you dont add (stani). the word `Hindu` encompasses both the religious affiliation and location of the person.



but they say hinduism is not a religion, it's a philosophy



which raises the question:

am i a theist or a philosopher?



what am i?

i hope you all don't become victims of identity crisis like i did.

[sp]

Yep, parinda man! I am a hindu(stani) .

you wanted to sound politically correct so you added (stani) after mentioning your religion..there might be mulsim readership here, but really you have got nothing to be scared of



that's what zakir nike too said in one of his speeches that he is a hindu because he lives in india. the term hindu has nothing to do with religion. `hindu` just identifies the geographic location of the `hindu` person in question



you wanted to put across the point that you don't openly profess your religion and want to be seen as a modern secularist.. ok! we get your point and people you wanted to make happy are happy that you don't identify with your religion and are a modern secularist. way to go with the flow! you are on the verge of identity crisis



so adding (stani) was not really necessary. People will get what you mean even if you dont add (stani). the word `Hindu` encompasses both the religious affiliation and location of the person.



but they say hinduism is not a religion, it's a philosophy



which raises the question:

am i a theist or a philosopher?



what am i?

i hope you all don't become victims of identity crisis like i did.

[sp]

The only people who will respond to your thread are you-know-who, culminating in a lot of slander, and further tarnishing the image of your favorite religion.

may i ask you what Your favourite religion is? it better be`hinduism`.



staying ambiguous about religion --is that the 'in' thing these days?

[akhilis2cool]

[CtrlAltDel]

..



one confused personality!